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Misha's avatar

> This sounds simple, but it was revolutionary. Alchemists certainly did experiments, but they often interpreted results through pre-existing frameworks... When an experiment didn't work, they might blame [..]. Early chemists began to treat unexpected results as potentially valuable information about how nature actually works, rather than as failures to achieve a predetermined goal.

It feels there is something very deep behind this mindshift. It increases the learning signal density per observation. And the "alchemist"/"scientist" mind stance differentiation seems widespread.

Encountering a bug in your program, answering a question from the textbook incorrectly, or failing to apply self-help advice. Curiosity in learning from negative results brings you much closer to almost any goal in the above endeavors (or "dissolving" a goal). However, the human default seems to ignore large or whole parts of the negative experience.

And this scientific mind stance seems really hard to notice and switch to, if you are in a "alchemist" mode!

1. There is a reflex of feeling bad that covers nodes linked to negative outcomes with 'ugh fields'.

2. And there is resistance towards switching to enjoying leaning towards contact with negative: "but I care about [working program/answering textbook questions right/being a good person/getting gold] - why should I seek leaning towards something that is the OPPOSITE? You want me to stop caring about my GOAL? No, thank you very much!"

Maybe this shift truly happens from some larger viewpoint or worldview?

River's avatar

I see now that I'm ironically much in a very similar place that psychiatry itself is in…i dabble in the “state of psychosis” with a lot of blundering, unscientific gathering of data loosely held in my own subjective memory… I study trance states and ancient ancestral practices around that; i also look at the phenomenon of possession by spirit (which i think the data from that can also be applied to your memetic theories and data you mention)… there's A LOT to gather and sort through, it seems to me… and I think that with the potential science at hand being a subjective one-- trial and error is a good scientific method to start with until we develop a good schematic of how The Thing operates…

All that said; glad to reconnect with you here, Michael-- it's been a minute!

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